Newbie T4 Fettler Saying Hi to fellow T4 owners!

[Activ8]

Not heard anything good about the chinese pump heads - but there's a lot of naysayers (mostly american) that will diss chinese made stuff yet still buy branded gear made in the same factories with the same machines.

A lot of the chinese stuff is good.

I bought a knockoff chinese bosch injection pump (petrol) and a genuine one - they had exactly the same witness marks from tooling on them - go figure!

I know people who have actually run the ebay turbos and had no problems


I've built dual plenum long runner inlet manifolds - and loads of hybrid pumps.

I want to build a proper equal length exhaust manifold to run a BMW 330D turbo for my 2.5....

Need to get my 240 injectors first - have you got any maps you are willing to share? (EDC 15 AJT)

Cheers for the feedback.
I'm going to buy a maXpeedingrods GT2871 GT2860 A/R .60 .64 SR20 Turbo and take a look. Looking at the Garret compressor map with the same spec I can map this, and make it work plus experiment with this water cooled turbo. Its old skool tech but hey the K14 & K16's still run reliably after 20 years.... not efficient but for £150 its something to play with right! Its going to be a squeeze in the existing space. Thought about running a non-turbo 5cyl manifold (easier to fabricate / borrow ) but piped to the turbo hanging under the van - where the cat used to sit - then running the pipework back to a onesided FMIC, possibly combine two inline back to the inlet.

Happy to put a map together for you, not a problem, anything I send out has been tried and tested on my own van(s).
I did spend a little time on a rolling road when I first played mapper but at £80 a shot and no time to ponder the results it wasn't value for money!
What do you want / need / desire?
May be we can swap some services? I'm fairly new to fabrication and servicing diesel components so ....

I've got several spare diesel pumps ACV , D5252T and a ton of injector bodies I've accumulated that need setting up with various nozzle sizes and at least one requiring a 12mm upgrade!.
Just bought a load of Volvo D5252T parts, manifolds, pumps, cylinder heads and a complete engine for my sins from a Volvo specialist down sizing!

[regcheeseman]

Cheers for the feedback.
I'm going to buy a maXpeedingrods GT2871 GT2860 A/R .60 .64 SR20 Turbo and take a look. Looking at the Garret compressor map with the same spec I can map this, and make it work plus experiment with this water cooled turbo. Its old skool tech but hey the K14 & K16's still run reliably after 20 years.... not efficient but for £150 its something to play with right! Its going to be a squeeze in the existing space. Thought about running a non-turbo 5cyl manifold (easier to fabricate / borrow ) but piped to the turbo hanging under the van - where the cat used to sit - then running the pipework back to a onesided FMIC, possibly combine two inline back to the inlet.

Happy to put a map together for you, not a problem, anything I send out has been tried and tested on my own van(s).
I did spend a little time on a rolling road when I first played mapper but at £80 a shot and no time to ponder the results it wasn't value for money!
What do you want / need / desire?
May be we can swap some services? I'm fairly new to fabrication and servicing diesel components so ....

I've got several spare diesel pumps ACV , D5252T and a ton of injector bodies I've accumulated that need setting up with various nozzle sizes and at least one requiring a 12mm upgrade!.
Just bought a load of Volvo D5252T parts, manifolds, pumps, cylinder heads and a complete engine for my sins from a Volvo specialist down sizing!

Very interesting stuff, I know little about turbos so sharing some knowledge and skills would be good.

I do know how to fab but have lost my tig access due to new job, I can definitely help with the pump and injector work. I'll post more later, at work at the mo.

[Activ8]

Stock setup can start to lift and weep just over 20 PSI

I was running 35 with ARP studs and a standard metal sandwich gasket.

Lots of tales about bent cranks/rods from too much low end boost and unequal boost pressure across ports on standard manifold, for this reason I designed a girdle kit (have the CAD files if you are interested) and the long runner dual plenum inlet.

This was all on the 1.9 block - did mess with a 1.6/1.9 hybrid as advocated in the states but it really doesn't work - that was a painful lesson for me in not believing the internets. The more I quizzed the people who were building the 'frankenmotor' the more the truth came out and the issues were identified.

I was running VNT turbo with a home made controller running a simple map, but in the end the servo actuator couldn't keep up so I ditched it and locked the vanes open - made little difference and there was no discernible lag as a result.

I've only ever owned one 1.9TD and never played with it, bought it on a Friday night whilst needing a vehicle filler as my daily was off the road and got offered silly money for it whilst in Sainsburys on the Sunday - so it had to go! Shame , so many 1.9 drivers on here I'm almost ashamed to own a 2.5! Ah well!

The learning curve carries its bumps if you're using the internet - info just seems to get recycled - but its all part of our British inventiveness / shed mentality that we all adore.
Hmmm - 20psi ideal mid range for the Volvo K14 - super reliable and cheap too.

[Activ8]

Great - look forward to working something out....

[Dan]

Cheers Dan, I think the lack of mapping expertise explains a lot and possibly the main reason for the lower performances of those that mirrored shadowmakers very open builds & forum guidance.

I'm intrigued by your engine failure? Did I understand this correctly? Why not rebuild, if it was kept? Although cost for us T4 owner always takes the main lead!
Did you use the AXG/AHY manifolds or fabricate your own to marry up with your large hybrid (can you recall what turbo specs / type you ended up with?)

So many questions....

I'm not on FB.





Sent from my SM-G901F using Just T4s

Yeah mapping has come on a long way since I built mine, initially started from bad timing which killed the cam and from we could work out killed the bearing caps.

Due to a change in work I no longer used the T4 and my missus had it so couldn’t justify spending money on a new cam and bottom end for something I wouldn’t trust her driving.

Exhaust mani was indeed the AXG and inlet was the ACV as I found that flowed better than a AXG one, the turbo was a hybrid Gt25 done by CR turbos. Can see if I can find the receipt for it see if it has the specs on.

I do still run all the bolt on bits on my 2.4d Doka but my quest for power on the 2.5tdi is no more. Might do one day in something different but have other projects and a house now which takes all funds!!

If you don’t have a AXG air box then I found that helped with flow loads!!

Pity you aren’t on FB as James Hardacre runs a group called T17 club and there’s some on there really pushing high gains. Might be worth joining just to have a read on there.

[regcheeseman]

Stock setup can start to lift and weep just over 20 PSI

I was running 35 with ARP studs and a standard metal sandwich gasket.

Lots of tales about bent cranks/rods from too much low end boost and unequal boost pressure across ports on standard manifold, for this reason I designed a girdle kit (have the CAD files if you are interested) and the long runner dual plenum inlet.

This was all on the 1.9 block - did mess with a 1.6/1.9 hybrid as advocated in the states but it really doesn't work - that was a painful lesson for me in not believing the internets. The more I quizzed the people who were building the 'frankenmotor' the more the truth came out and the issues were identified.

I was running VNT turbo with a home made controller running a simple map, but in the end the servo actuator couldn't keep up so I ditched it and locked the vanes open - made little difference and there was no discernible lag as a result.

I've only ever owned one 1.9TD and never played with it, bought it on a Friday night whilst needing a vehicle filler as my daily was off the road and got offered silly money for it whilst in Sainsburys on the Sunday - so it had to go! Shame , so many 1.9 drivers on here I'm almost ashamed to own a 2.5! Ah well!

The learning curve carries its bumps if you're using the internet - info just seems to get recycled - but its all part of our British inventiveness / shed mentality that we all adore.
Hmmm - 20psi ideal mid range for the Volvo K14 - super reliable and cheap too.

Above figures are for a 1.9 engine.

I'm now playing with the my 2.5 but still do a lot of 1.9s

I have a volvo K14 on the shelf and had assumed it was dimensionally the same as the K14 fitted to my AJT - is this not the case. I've not really looked at it, it came with a set of injectors I gave it a spin with my fingers and then stuck it back in the box and up in the loft.

Wouldn't mind a spare volvo engine to build up - I should have bought the one attached to the injectors and turbo I've already got

[Activ8]

When you say play - its a hobby for you right, or are you in an associated trade?

The volvo K14 is actually a K14 sized oil housing, the compressor snail is K16 with a larger compressor, FYI the snail is externally the same size as a K24!
The turbine is larger too and generally with good maintenance and oil changes they outlast the T4's K14.... plus its got a T2 manifold mount.
I did the maths on the compressor wheel and its good for 200bhp possibly slightly more in an and ideal world!
Working on an an upgrade on the Volvo in the garage which is mathematically good to 231.

I've fitted the Volvo turbo on another van and it flies with the correct set-up. They can run 20psi all-day, producing 1275mg/s at the MAF.
With an AFR of 16:1 thats almost 80mg/s of fuel which almost maxes out the fuel flow on an 11mm VP37 (? - maybe you know more about this side of things)
I'd love to hear about the pump hybrids you've worked on, does the Volvo version have a higher cam lobe/disc toWhen you say play - its a hobby for you right, or are you in an associated trade?

The volvo K14 is actually a K16 oil housing, the compressor snail is K16 with a larger compressor, FYI the snail is externally the same size as a K24!
The turbine is larger too and generally with good maintenance and oil changes they outlast the T4's K14.... plus its got a T2 manifold mount.
I did the maths on the compressor wheel and its good for 200bhp possibly slightly more in an and ideal world!
Working on an an upgrade on the Volvo in the garage which is mathematically good to 231.

I've fitted the Volvo turbo on another van and it flies with the correct set-up. They can run 20psi all-day, producing 1275mg/s at the MAF.
With an AFR of 16:1 thats almost 80mg/s of fuel which almost maxes out the fuel flow on an 11mm VP37 (? - maybe you know more about this side of things)
I'd love to hear about the pump hybrids you've worked on, does the Volvo version have a higher cam lobe/disc to equal the AXG/AHY?

Have you got a diesel injector tester?
Remember the Volvo injectors are good to 220bhp so your 0.240's might not be actually needed - depending on your power goals! equal the AXG/AHY?

Have you got a diesel injector tester?
Remember the Volvo injectors are good to 220bhp so your 0.240's might not be actually needed - depending on your power goals!

[Activ8]

Yes I've come to realise there are a lot of scammers in the mapping world...
I had my van mapped by Chip Wizards in 2007 - it worked - but looking at the map now, I was ripped off big style (is that too strong a word!) , but in hind sight I was lazy and followed the rest of the vans who qualified the work!

What do you mean by "flow loads", its not a daft question - honest, just trying to put that into numerical form - got any old VAGCOM logs?
What AFR did you run?

I've looked at the T17 website, its interesting. Maybe next year....

[regcheeseman]

When you say play - its a hobby for you right, or are you in an associated trade?

The volvo K14 is actually a K14 sized oil housing, the compressor snail is K16 with a larger compressor, FYI the snail is externally the same size as a K24!
The turbine is larger too and generally with good maintenance and oil changes they outlast the T4's K14.... plus its got a T2 manifold mount.
I did the maths on the compressor wheel and its good for 200bhp possibly slightly more in an and ideal world!
Working on an an upgrade on the Volvo in the garage which is mathematically good to 231.

I've fitted the Volvo turbo on another van and it flies with the correct set-up. They can run 20psi all-day, producing 1275mg/s at the MAF.
With an AFR of 16:1 thats almost 80mg/s of fuel which almost maxes out the fuel flow on an 11mm VP37 (? - maybe you know more about this side of things)
I'd love to hear about the pump hybrids you've worked on, does the Volvo version have a higher cam lobe/disc to equal the AXG/AHY?

Have you got a diesel injector tester?
Remember the Volvo injectors are good to 220bhp so your 0.240's might not be actually needed - depending on your power goals!

Yep play. Borne from necessity (a leaky T4 2.4 pump) and turned into a bit of a hobby/interest/sideline.

What did it involve fitting the K14, modified oil lines/inlet pipe or any clocking required? I’ll be making a downpipe anyway so I’ll do that to suit whatever is fitted.

I don’t know a lot about the performance specs of the five pot pump head.

I’ve not had a lot of TDI units apart at all – I’ve always been old school indirect injection and refuse to believe that direct injection was anything more than a passing fad

Hybrid pumps have been indirect or MTdi, head swaps, LDA conversions and camplate swaps

I have got a basic pop tester.

The Volvo nozzles were .216s, I bought the Gibonta 240 nozzles with a 200 bhp goal in mind (based on the specs from Darkside – not sure what my clutch and gearbox will make of that though.

[Activ8]

If you've a spare AJT/ACV exhaust manifold die-grind the turbo mount to the larger T2 Volvo turbo inlet but after making an adaptor the same size to take the 4 pin studs. There's enough meat in it to do it safely - don't hit the internals too hard or make it to thin! Clean up the ports at the same time. Will take a pic of one on my bench.

The existing T4 oil feed will fit fine, but the return needs to be a hybrid of the Volvo pipe and T4 unless you want to get a braided line made-up. I used some oil hose and banjos and it worked fine (fit the turbo line side before mounting the turbo as there's little room afterwards.

Use the first 20cm of Volvo DP (2.5") to make up a down pipe , some Saab units have a usable DP aswell. I'm using 2.5" flexible exhaust pipe after this which gets me - with 2m length - 2/3rd the way down the van before the next exhaust section or silencer is needed.

The volvo nozzles are 0.210 but will make the sort of power you want so long as they run 220+ bar at 1st stage pop. There's a tolerance on the injector so higher would improve the spray pattern. I've found the injectors run better with smaller nozzles as it keeps the nozzles a lot cleaner, had some good results on the standard AJT injectors too. You cannot tell the difference if I'm honest.


Sent from my SM-G901F using Just T4s

[S49]

Sounds like you chaps have hit it off ,kindred spirits, will watch with interest as its all further than i'd have thought to go.

[Activ8]

It's one of the reasons we drive T4's , we're all soul mates - right?

Sent from my SM-G901F using Just T4s

[S49]

Dead right there mate

[Activ8]

And partly mad of course!

Sent from my SM-G901F using Just T4s

[S49]

Oh I don't know its the rest that are mad not us.