Not T4 - yamaha SZR

[No Sliders]

The guy at Ace Custom Vans finished his very recently - reminded me of your thread.
Nice to see one that doesn't have a tan seat and satin black paint job for a change.

[regcheeseman]

Lots of playing with my TIG, welding up holes in the frame and now I've come to the big job that I've been building up to, not looking forward to welding up to this cast.



Its a big piece of ally tube, the plan is to remove the aux oil tank and put the oil in the frame for dry sump, but the frame is only 2.4 litres (ish) and I need 3.1 so the pipe adds an extra 0.8 litres.
Of course I've got into a 'discussion' with the FZR facebook group, one chub end thinks it is a bad idea because oil tanks have to be round and only connected to V8s or something - ha twats on the internet...i've shit em.

I ground back a large cast boss on the frame as it's not required but it left a crack around the cast section where it joined the frame extrusion, so ground it out with the dremel


And then tried to fill in the crack, the cast material started spitting crap out so I had to make repeated passes, clean and then pass over it again until it stopped spewing out shite into the weld pool.



Oh yeah - I drove the T4 earlier, so yeah legitimate content. My boy was chuffed I picked him up in the van instead of the corsa, he said you could hear it whistling all the way down the road.

[regcheeseman]

Fitted the oil filler tube on the inside of the frame today, got a bit of a problem as there's a small section of weld I just cannot get to, chemical metal I guess..



Now to add the feed to the oil pump, decided on adding a barbed fitting so I can undo it and drain the tank/frame if I need to


In order to fit it I need to let in a thick piece of plate that will hold the threaded fitting

[DubDick]

I couldn't understand why you're going to such trouble to use the frame as an oil tank, that is until I found a picture of the LHS of a standard bike.. what were Yamaha thinking, and that oil feed pipe looks so vulnerable too... so good work Reg.
I like frame oil tanks, my DRZ has one and it's great for cooking all the oil out of the steering bearings.

[regcheeseman]

I couldn't understand why you're going to such trouble to use the frame as an oil tank, that is until I found a picture of the LHS of a standard bike.. what were Yamaha thinking, and that oil feed pipe looks so vulnerable too... so good work Reg.
I like frame oil tanks, my DRZ has one and it's great for cooking all the oil out of the steering bearings.

You found a picture of the LHS? people never bother taking a shot of that side cos it is so damn ugly. I put the job up on an SZR facebook page where it was well received apart from one knob end who said it's a really bad idea and then proceeded to post picture of V8s with 'proper' oil tanks and that there was no way the SZR could work with a square irregular tank, I pointed out the XT with same engine uses the frame, the MZ with the same engine uses a square remote tank, the KTM uses a square tank, my old buell put the oil in the swingarm etc etc and none of these bikes suffer from oil feed issues. But then he's an expert and knows better...gotta love twats on the facebook!

[DubDick]

Yeh.. I'm not on facebook.
Buell's were/are cool, very innovative.. I can't believe he sold the brand to HD, who killed it.

To be honest I wouldn't have worried about the slight loss capacity using just the frame (without that extra tube). I'd just adjust the oil change interval accordingly, maybe fit an oil cooler for the added capacity and/or extra cooling.

[regcheeseman]

Yeh.. I'm not on facebook.
Buell's were/are cool, very innovative.. I can't believe he sold the brand to HD, who killed it.

To be honest I wouldn't have worried about the slight loss capacity using just the frame (without that extra tube). I'd just adjust the oil change interval accordingly, maybe fit an oil cooler for the added capacity and/or extra cooling.

With you on that extra tube, but I wanted peace of mind; have considered an oil cooler as well.

[regcheeseman]

I bought a header tank from an aprillia as it looked about the right size and shape and got lucky as it sits in the headstock nicely



Theres a head stay bracket that fits across the frame below the tank, that I can use to hold the tank, but it needed modifying for clearance before adding brackets with captive nuts, I hate non-captive nuts on a build.



Fits in there nice, think I can squeeze the coil in the vacant space as well, drilled and tapped the headstock to M6, fitted some bolts from inside the headstock (fiddly) then added some hex M6 stainless extenders to make up spacers so I can fit the coil.



Header tank fitted on bracket and coil tucked in behind



So, why do all this? When you take a fairing of a bike you are left with a heap of bits that the manufacturers typically just hide behind the fairing, with the fairing gone they are ugly and on show. Some builders put a lot of stuff under the seat or the rear plastics on the bike but that isn't an option for me. So up behind the headstock it is.

I cant get away from it now, I've procrastinated as after my gearbox welding problems I don't want to try welding the big pipe into the cast frame. I have to bite the bullet and go for it



Thankfully it all went really well and the pipe is in, fully seam welded, now to knock up a battery tray, remodelling the one that came with the bike.



Then I made up some brackets with material left over from the ill fated gearbox work



A 40mm spacer turned from some ally bar with a 10mm hole through the middle and the new subframe mount is sat in position on the frame ready to be welded in place



Ironically the donor bike for this frame - the TZR250 - has this bracket as standard, it's cut off by yamaha for the SZR as it is not used on the standard subframe, preferring to use two mounts on the edge of the frame.
This central single mount method means less visual weight around the rear of the bike adding to the impression of minimal, lightweight stripped down cafe racer. At least that is the plan.


It was now time to test the oil holding capabilities of the frame, I pour just under 3 litres of water into the filler and three days later there's not a drop on the floor and the level visible in the filler neck is the same. Result.

Now, the oil tank is vented and under no pressure but we all know how oil like to find a way to escape if it can, so with the frame still full of water I pressurise the frame with the airline to 20psi. and there are 5 little pin hole weeps from various places.

4 of the weeps are around the base of the filler tube, so I grind back, flow more metal in and refill with water and pressurize, I'm now chasing 2 holes around the filler tube, so far I've done the grind back, weld, fill with water and pressurise thing four times now and still the holes persist I'm just moving them about. Just try a few more times before giving up and going for chemical metal..

[TommyP]

I took from this that the gearbox welding can go ahead now and we’ll all be having 6 speed boxes?


Sent from my iPhone using Just T4s

[DubDick]

I wouldn't worry about those tiny holes at the base of the filler tube, the oil shouldn't be at that level anyway, and an oil tank needs to be vented anyway.

Edit: just looking at it you probably need the oil filled to the top in order to get the capacity from the frame?

[regcheeseman]

I wouldn't worry about those tiny holes at the base of the filler tube, the oil shouldn't be at that level anyway, and an oil tank needs to be vented anyway.

Edit: just looking at it you probably need the oil filled to the top in order to get the capacity from the frame?

Yep you got it on the edit, just under 3 litres (standard capacity) with oil half way up the filler.

[DubDick]

You not worried about having some head in the tank for the foam to settle out?
Also hot & aerated oil will take up more volume than cold settled oil.. if it's already that tight in there right now I can see an oil drenched engine in your future.

[regcheeseman]

You not worried about having some head in the tank for the foam to settle out?
Also hot & aerated oil will take up more volume than cold settled oil.. if it's already that tight in there right now I can see an oil drenched engine in your future.

Yeah maybe I should have used both spars....bit late now.

[regcheeseman]

Damn you Dubdick. Your sage advice set paranoid alarm bells ringing, I'm conscious the capacity of the frame was borderline.
so I decided to use the other spar as well, the tube I put in has a blank at one end, there's no way I want to take that tube out again so I've drilled on an angle through the tube and through the blanking plate, drilling at random angle to try and fit as many holes in as possible. Now I have to seal up the other spar as well.....and fill the hole I put in the tube. Oh and vent the other spar as well.

[arfur fox-acre]

How are you going to get the swarf out?
I think the oil cooler idea was probably the best shout, extra capacity and cooler oil for those 2 days of summer you will have.